09:06 Mister Saxon i've embedded a copy in the front page
09:06 +AMD Looks nice!
09:07 Mister Saxon :D
10:55 Dr. X hello!
10:55 minaru hi just passing by. Am reading the archives. Love the work
10:55 minaru hi!
10:55 Dr. X thanks :D
10:55 minaru :) no problem
10:56 minaru I'm starting on season 3
10:56 minaru -so late-
10:56 Dr. X XD
10:57 minaru i hope to catch up and stuff
10:57 Dr. X you're making good progress :D
10:57 minaru thanks! :)
10:57 minaru it's nice to meet you
10:57 Dr. X thanks :)
11:00 minaru ..Okay...I feel totally speechless right now....
11:00 Dr. X random babbling is good?
11:00 minaru hehe yes...I suppose. XD
11:02 Dr. X So are you using the meebo off the front page of the site
11:02 minaru hehe yeah
11:02 minaru I decided to hang a bit
11:03 Dr. X I just decided to stick it on there this morning
11:03 minaru I've been spending a lot of time finishing season 2
11:03 Dr. X ahh
11:03 minaru lucky me!!!
11:03 minaru i get to be the first to try this app out
11:03 Dr. X well on this page XD
11:03 minaru ...okay...one of the first
11:03 minaru XD
11:03 Dr. X it's been on the main chat page for a while now
11:03 minaru oh...never noticed...haha I usually come here for the chat
11:04 Yaijinden /cheer!
11:04 Yaijinden /cheer
11:04 Yaijinden ...
11:04 minaru never knew you could use meebo this way
11:04 Yaijinden Clearly scrolling up is a problem I need to resolve.
11:04 minaru hehe what's wrong?
11:05 Yaijinden Wondering why text doesn't appear when you've got the scroll bar further up the page.
11:05 Yaijinden It's, like, totally by desiiiiign.
11:05 minaru that's odd...doesn't seem to happen to me
11:06 Yaijinden I's referring to the meebo scroll bar, but that's how that happens or somethingishadish.
11:06 Dr. X hmm
11:07 Yaijinden Problem was fixed when I realized my oversight.
11:07 Dr. X ahh
11:07 minaru damn I better get going. am kinda sleepy. It was nice to meet you both. I hope we can chat again!
11:08 Dr. X cya later!
11:08 minaru :) okay
11:08 Yaijinden /wave
11:10 Dr. X I wish I could mod the colors of this chat but oh well
11:11 Yaijinden That would be impossibly nice.
11:11 Dr. X well see they won't customizer the app for you unless you have like a million visitors a day or some such
11:11 Yaijinden ...
11:11 Yaijinden Wow.
11:11 Dr. X I wish I was exaggerating that
11:12 Dr. X IMO they are throwing money away ignoring smaller customers
11:12 Dr. X I would pay a small fee to have certain things changed
11:13 Dr. X and frankly a simple style sheet would probably be able to fix the cosmetics
11:13 Dr. X YO DOOKY
11:13 Dr. X WHASSUP
11:13 Dr. X (that never gets old)
11:17 dooky|ss2 >.>
11:17 Dr. X :D
11:17 dooky|ss2 So I just now noticed this thing is on the front page...
11:17 Dr. X I just added it
11:18 Dr. X As you can see I was tampering with the front page a bity
11:19 dooky|ss2 I like the... clock thing. With that character I keep seeing but don't know who she is >.>
11:19 Dr. X she's a vocaloid
11:20 Dr. X miku hatsune I believe
11:20 Dr. X if you click on her she says the time
11:21 Oronde dr. x??
11:22 dooky|ss2 <.<
11:22 Dr. X (testing) no
11:22 Oronde yes..you are.. dr. x.. hehehe :)
11:22 Dr. X (testing) heh
11:22 Oronde what you doing?
11:22 Dr. X (testing) making my time
11:22 Oronde hmms your time?/ *blinks..8 you mean a time stamp??
11:23 Dr. X (testing) It's a Zero Wing reference
11:23 Oronde oh??
11:23 Dr. X (testing)4 yes
11:24 Dr. X gneh n way to modify the colors by CSS
11:24 Dr. X ^no
11:25 dooky|ss2 I should probably learn CSS.
11:26 dooky|ss2 But if I did, I wouldnh't have the fun times inherent in manually adding the same bit of code to 100+ pages!
11:26 Dr. X I know basics of it, but i stull suck at using it for positioning
11:26 Dr. X I just use it tio style things and use tables for most everything elsed
11:26 dooky|ss2 I am still in love with tables.
11:27 Dr. X Because I have no patience to accomodate fifty different browser implementations
11:27 Dr. X yeah I know, tables just WORK.
11:27 Dr. X I mean the frotn page is basically just tables.
11:27 Dr. X I tried doing the ichat with CSS and oh god it was a horrible mess.
11:28 Dr. X still it does help when used like a seasoning
11:28 dooky|ss2 I bought a slightly out-of-date book in 2002, and learned HTML from that. I'm still using it today >.>
11:28 Dr. X I learned by viewing source and figuring out what that source did
11:29 dooky|ss2 I did once make a style-switcher for a site I was planning. I had fun trying to make it work in Netscape 4.
11:29 dooky|ss2 I'm glad I don't have to worry about Netscape 4 anymore...
11:29 Dr. X I am glad I won't have to wrry about IE6 soon.
11:29 dooky|ss2 :P
11:29 Dr. X XD
11:31 dooky|ss2 Hmm, around 10% of my users still use IE6.
11:31 dooky|ss2 And my visitors are somewhat pro-Firefox on the whole >.>
11:32 Dr. X I'm doing my best not to start an argument XD
11:32 Dr. X suffice it to say I have reasons why I'm designing for FF XD
11:32 dooky|ss2 I admire your restraint!
11:33 Dr. X I try XD
11:34 dooky|ss2 The balance between them does seem to have shifted in the last few years.
11:34 Dr. X Well with IE8 shipping with standards compliant by default that may tip.
11:34 Dr. X ^shipping as
11:34 Dr. X There's just a philosophical difference I think
11:35 Dr. X For instance with the debut of IE7 extensions were added
11:35 Dr. X but when you go to get them, most of them are pay extensions
11:35 dooky|ss2 Yeah, that was kind of a non-starter.
11:35 Dr. X yeah, MS kind of missed the point
11:36 Dr. X Web designers tend to get annoyed by IE because they have to work around it a lot
11:36 Dr. X if 8 changes that
11:36 Dr. X then it makes their jobs easier
11:37 dooky|ss2 I won't dispute IE's standards-related issues.
11:37 dooky|ss2 Although I'm relieved Firefox finally fixed that title-text bug.
11:38 Dr. X I still don't use certain things like margin and padding because I don't want things to explode too badly on IE
11:40 dooky|ss2 There are some differences in the way they display tables. Trying to get a table of a precise size is frustrating...
11:40 Dr. X but whenever I load the main page in IE7 the site just DRAGS and I dion't know why
11:40 Dr. X in IE it renders instantly
11:40 Dr. X err FF
11:40 dooky|ss2 Hmm.
11:40 Dr. X tables huh
11:40 dooky|ss2 I've noticed that.
11:40 Dr. X that's odd that's one area where I find them uniform
11:41 dooky|ss2 It's nowhere near as bad as it used to be.
11:41 Dr. X one thing I do is set all my tables to CELLLPADING=0 CELLPSPACING=0 BORDER=0
11:41 Dr. X And I typoed that
11:41 Dr. X but it generally kills any gaps between cells
11:42 Dr. X so you can get things tight
11:42 Dr. X also in IE you sometimes have to not have gaps between <TR> and <TD> elements
11:42 Dr. X like if you're splitting an imaghe across several cells
11:42 Dr. X you might notice a gap if you do it thus:
11:43 Dr. X <TD><IMG HERE></TD> <TD><IMG HERE></TD>
11:43 Dr. X if you remove that space in between
11:43 Dr. X the gap goes away
11:43 Dr. X by all rights that space should nto matter
11:43 Dr. X but it does
11:43 dooky|ss2 Ahh, I'll look into that.
11:43 dooky|ss2 I had a situation where I needed a table to be a precise vertical size in order to fit exactly into an iframe. But there were a few pixels of disagreement between different browsers, so I ended up with an unnecessary scrollbar.
11:44 Dr. X oh,yes.
11:44 Dr. X well the onlu thing to do thwere might be to turn off the scrollbars in the iframe
11:44 Dr. X set the margin on the page with the table to 0
11:44 Dr. X then turn off the scrollbars in the iframe
11:44 Dr. X that should give you thr tightest fit
11:44 dooky|ss2 Yeah, but I NEED to be able to scroll horizontally ^_^;;
11:44 dooky|ss2 Just not vertically.
11:44 Dr. X ... ahhh
11:45 dooky|ss2 There's no way to turn off one but not the other.
11:45 Dr. X i know
11:45 dooky|ss2 I was actually kind of surprised when I discovered it was impossible.
11:45 Dr. X I know you'd think they would make this stuff more independent
11:46 Dr. X well here's something you could try (but it may not work ion safari)
11:46 dooky|ss2 It was the first time I'd ever been told (in the field of web design) "This just can't be done."
11:46 Dr. X make a <DIV> element to hold the table
11:46 Dr. X and set that to have an overflow
11:46 Dr. X it's how I used to do the SS chats on the front page
11:47 Dr. X it will generate the appropraite scrollbar
11:47 dooky|ss2 Hmm, I'll have a go at that.
11:48 dooky|ss2 It's been a while since i dabbled in <div>s...
11:48 Dr. X they are useful things
11:48 Dr. X I suck at positioning them but for containing things they are useful
11:51 dooky|ss2 Cool. Thanks for your help!
11:51 Dr. X no probs
17:53 Oronde hmms..
18:14 GERMATOID HMMS
